TF Ombre Leather Vs Tuscan Leather

[PrinceRF]

Tuscan Leather, with its bombastic combination of fresh-from-the-factory leather jacket smell and the alleged cocaine accord, certainly hasn't registered to the general public as a feminine scent, perhaps just because of its sheer aggressiveness and rough-edged force.

That would be my guess as to why.

[slpfrsly]

We all have our different associations with leather aromas (some folks on here have even claimed that the TF scents don't evoke leather for them at all), but it feels like the consensus of the moment is that TL is firmly a "masculine," perhaps the most aggressively so of the TF Private Blend "anchor" scents.

Tuscan Leather, with its bombastic combination of fresh-from-the-factory leather jacket smell and the alleged cocaine accord, certainly hasn't registered to the general public as a feminine scent, perhaps just because of its sheer aggressiveness and rough-edged force. I regularly read jokes about alleged badasses sweating Tuscan Leather or what-have-you.

Ombré Leather 16 was, so the story goes, created to be a feminine-leaning flanker to Tuscan Leather, but it still sold to men, and so TF dialed back the floral element when it was released in the Signature line in 2018.

Yeah, I don't understand that. I think some people have a rather simplistic, almost linear scale of the masculine-feminine divide, as if darkness or strength cannot be feminine; feminine just means florals and sweetness and light and all that. For me, though TL is evidently dark and sharp, it smells like a new leather handbag. A softer, more worn leather is distinctly more masculine - even without the ruggedness of an animalic note, or veering towards perhaps more 'Russian' or 'Spanish' leather territory. Worn leather smells like work or, more generally, 'use'. New leather smells like a handbag. It could be encapsulated by brown leather v black leather: TL is the latter.

When you add in the raspberry - which I don't detect all that strongly in TL, not compared to some of its derivatives, like the one from Byredo (can't remember the name) - then it becomes indisputably feminine...in my opinion.

I think when it comes to nominally 'dark' fragrances, other people tend to be all over the place. I can't believe Herod is described the way it is, for example. It's one of the most feminine-smelling fragrances I've encountered, all powdery and pink. It's far more feminine than vanilla bombs like Stronger With You, even.

I wonder if there's a cultural divide more than anything else. I know there is when it comes to spice and I wonder if leather is the same. TL smells like female power dressing, and not a particularly 'nice' one, either. I can't fathom how a man could wear it. The toned down OL on the other hand, though still in the 'new leather' category, is less overly feminine. I can't be the only one who thinks this - I reckon if you had a young, attractive couple walk past, say, 100 strangers on the street, and they caught the waft of TL...if you asked them who was wearing it, man or woman, most would lean to the woman. It smells like a powerful woman's scent.

[hellbentforleather]

We all have our different associations with leather aromas (some folks on here have even claimed that the TF scents don't evoke leather for them at all), but it feels like the consensus of the moment is that TL is firmly a "masculine," perhaps the most aggressively so of the TF Private Blend "anchor" scents.

Tuscan Leather, with its bombastic combination of fresh-from-the-factory leather jacket smell and the alleged cocaine accord, certainly hasn't registered to the general public as a feminine scent, perhaps just because of its sheer aggressiveness and rough-edged force. I regularly read jokes about alleged badasses sweating Tuscan Leather or what-have-you.

Ombré Leather 16 was, so the story goes, created to be a feminine-leaning flanker to Tuscan Leather, but it still sold to men, and so TF dialed back the floral element when it was released in the Signature line in 2018.

Definitely agree. The jasmine in OL makes it lean feminine for me as well. TL is simply rougher by comparison though in an aesthetically pleasing way to my nose.

[Brooks Otterlake]

New leather smells like a handbag.

Or a fresh-off-the-rack designer motorcycle jacket purchased at the Via de' Tornabuoni.

I've always felt that the reason the TF leathers evoke "luxury" in the modern mind is because luxury-and-newness are one and the same in the designer-dominated luxury market. Contemporary luxury is about acquisition of new goods, about keeping up with the latest-and-greatest-and-shiniest. It's the difference between "new money" luxury and "old money" luxury. Tom Ford largely caters to the former. Houses like Floris and L'Artisan and Santa Maria Novella are for the latter.

So Tom Ford's "luxury" isn't a well-worn leather jacket, but that freshly unpackaged leather jacket with a hefty price tag that you're wearing for the first time and are excited to show off to all your sure-to-be-envious friends.

[PrinceRF]

So Tom Ford's "luxury" isn't a well-worn leather jacket, but that freshly unpackaged leather jacket with a hefty price tag that you're wearing for the first time and are excited to show off to all your sure-to-be-envious friends.

Yep - I always thought Tuscan Leather was reminiscent of a brand new luxury Italian leather jacket.

[speckmann0706]

How you all feel about Montale Aoud Leather, I’ve added this one and have yet to wear it but hear it’s quite nice and resembles both TL and OL.

I’m debating picking up a 100ml of OL 18 I think it will fit nicely in my rotation and be quite versatile.

[slpfrsly]

Or a fresh-off-the-rack designer motorcycle jacket purchased at the Via de' Tornabuoni.

I've always felt that the reason the TF leathers evoke "luxury" in the modern mind is because luxury-and-newness are one and the same in the designer-dominated luxury market. Contemporary luxury is about acquisition of new goods, about keeping up with the latest-and-greatest-and-shiniest. It's the difference between "new money" luxury and "old money" luxury. Tom Ford largely caters to the former. Houses like Floris and L'Artisan and Santa Maria Novella are for the latter.

So Tom Ford's "luxury" isn't a well-worn leather jacket, but that freshly unpackaged leather jacket with a hefty price tag that you're wearing for the first time and are excited to show off to all your sure-to-be-envious friends.

No, I don't think so. Not quite. A 'new' leather jacket is a rarity, a fleeting thing - or for poseurs who never actually wear it. I'd stand by the rather sweeping 'worn v new' divide between masculine/feminine. There's nothing particularly masculine about most wannabe hipster Brandos, anyway, and the smell of new leather is - if a person, rather than something like a car interior - feminine. Particularly in the form it's in in TL with the sweetness. If anything, it's veering in to dominatrix territory - it's definitely not the smell of a biker jacket because...well...that's made to be worn and to smell rough and rugged within no time unlike the much more 'protected' nature of a handbag which is designed to be kept clean if not pristine. TL isn't that kind of worn rugged leather. It's strong, it's dark, but in a 'whips and chains' way more than busting hippies' heads, or even trying to look like Justin Theroux. I'd stand by this point but won't try to convince you!

[Brooks Otterlake]

A 'new' leather jacket is a rarity, a fleeting thing

Sure, but it's also a vivid thing. The excitement that accompanies new ownership tends to overshadow the day-to-day, at least as far as memory goes.

[PrinceRF]

Sure, but it's also a vivid thing. The excitement that accompanies new ownership tends to overshadow the day-to-day, at least as far as memory goes.

For me, too.

[hellbentforleather]

Yep - I always thought Tuscan Leather was reminiscent of a brand new luxury Italian leather jacket.

Agree. I bought a new pair of leather boots and they instantly reminded me of TL. Also, worn leather jackets/boots don't tend to retain much smell over time. Much the 'smell' we attribute to leather are the chemicals used in the tanning process.

[PStoller]

Much of the 'smell' we attribute to leather are the chemicals used in the tanning process.

Yep. And there are different chemicals depending on the type of item, the era in which it was tanned, or just the practices of the particular tannery.

I'm one of those who remains unconvinced by TF leathers—I get "pleather"—but if it works for you, great. Similarly, I perceive no distinct gender association with any TF leather. I just know I don't want my leather to smell like some kid spilled raspberry jam on it.

[Brooks Otterlake]

Also, worn leather jackets/boots don't tend to retain much smell over time. Much the 'smell' we attribute to leather are the chemicals used in the tanning process.

Indeed.

My preferred leather scent these days is Floris Leather Oud, which blows any of the TF scents out of the water. Has a kind of "saddle leather" feel, I'd say.

I am still working through my bottle of Ombré Leather 16, but I won't try to find a substitute once it's gone.

[slpfrsly]

Haha, man, I have to completely disagree with everything I'm reading. Leather definitely has a smell even if it's centuries old. An no, it's really not just the tanning chemicals.

Has a fragrance caught that sense/smell? Not sure, I haven't smelled it, but then I haven't explored the leather genre all that deeply due to being put off by TL and its associated leather scents.

[hellbentforleather]

Yep. And there are different chemicals depending on the type of item, the era in which it was tanned, or just the practices of the particular tannery.

Exactly. And just a quick search shows that actual perfumes are used in the various tanning processes as well. Apparently, we're going to have argue ad nauseam in the face of actual evidence though .

[PStoller]

Exactly. And just a quick search shows that actual perfumes are used in the various tanning processes as well. Apparently, we're going to have argue ad nauseam in the face of actual evidence though .

Oh, we don't have to. There's little harm in letting people stick to their unloaded guns.

[slpfrsly]

Leather has a smell. It's animal hide. I worked with enough of it growing up to know that, indisputably, leather has a smell. If both of you take your education from wikipedia then more fool you.

[slpfrsly]

But, I think this does make sense - if those claiming worn leather doesn't smell of anything think new leather is a masculine scent, that tends to suggest a massive inexperience with leather. Which validates my supposition about the masc/fem, worn/new dichotomy.

[Brooks Otterlake]

But, I think this does make sense - if those claiming worn leather doesn't smell of anything think new leather is a masculine scent, that tends to suggest a massive inexperience with leather.

I own a lot of leather goods, old and new, and relish breaking them in. Worn leather, unto itself, does not have a consistent smell. The treating process has a lot to do with that, I would imagine. My vegetable-tanned leathers do maintain a smell, but they're all all pretty different from my burnished leathers or suede. My Italian leather gloves don't smell like much of anything anymore.

Animal hide definitely does have a smell. But animal hide and a treated, sanded-down "genuine leather" good are two very different things.

[slpfrsly]

I agree, it doesn't have an idenetical smell - old leather will take up all manner of aromas as well. Say a biker jacket - chances are it's going to be greasy if you're doing enough travelling on it that you're also working on it as you wear the jacket. But worn leather most definitely has a smell, and it's not 'just' the treatment process that causes that smell as suggested. Think of all the materials that have as scent - not a strong scent, but still, an aroma nonetheless. And leather doesn't have a smell other than other than the chemicals used? Worn leather smells vastly different from new leather, hence my point, and hence the fact that it's not merely the treatment process that gives leather its distinctive smell(s). Does wool not smell of wool? Does cotton not smell of cotton? I find it odd to hear that leather doesn't smell of 'anything'...because it definitely does!

This thread has become a bit of a dead end tbh. The point was being laboured several comments ago. There's what feels like some weird, personal sniping going on from a few users and I'm just not interested in it tbh. I totally accept that some people see these scents as masculine, some as unisex; myself, I read them as feminine, even if they go 'darker' than other leathers. Older leather fragrances lean more masculine for me but I haven't tried enough to really isolate or explain what or why that is; most obviously, though, it's because they don't smell like new leather - whether that's a car interior, a handbag, a new shoe, or even a leather jacket. Particularly when you add the raspberry element on to TL, and I'd go back to the 'blind' test of a couple on a street, or in a taxi or lift/elevator - who would most people assume is wearing the scent. I would think the majority of people would read it as feminine as well but I am open to the prospect that I'm wrong about that.

[MegaMav]

BOIS 1920 Oro is the best I've tried of this genre. So good it feels like a mic drop.

[slpfrsly]

I dug out my sample of Tuscan Leather Intense this evening and gave it a try. It's pretty much as I remember - decent, toned down, but unexceptional. It's basically 'the same' fragrance made at least a few times; although I haven't tried Ombre Leaher 16, I'd stick by my original suggestion. There's no need to seek out one of the more expensive leathers, the main 'new leather' accord is in all of them and although Tuscan Leather Intense probably is 'the best' of the lot just by virtue of being a slightly nicer blend and not as pungent as TL, it's definitely not worth the money compared to OL.

I'd hazard a guess that other brands have done the 'new leather' accord better: as is the case in many fragrances TF seems to create. Top marks for trendsetting, but I think superior alternatives must surely exist for the leathers as there are for the woods, tobaccos, ouds etc.

[GoldWineMemories]

But, I think this does make sense - if those claiming worn leather doesn't smell of anything think new leather is a masculine scent, that tends to suggest a massive inexperience with leather. Which validates my supposition about the masc/fem, worn/new dichotomy.

I haven't heard that dichotomy idea before, and that's very interesting. That being said, you're being very aggressive when it's unneeded, because you're wrong. Leather does lose it's smell. I have a nice Schott jacket that smells of nothing. I'm not calling into question your expertise of the leather you worked with, but you do have a blind spot, and instead of acknowledging it you're doubling down on being wrong.

[slpfrsly]

Am I? What do you mean by 'lose'? If you're saying it smells of nothing then, no, you're wrong. If you mean 'lessens', then - obviously. It still retains a smell while also becoming more inherently 'leather-like', to my mind. New leather smell is not what I'd consider the archetypal smell of leather, but then obviously other people will have their own ideas of what that is. I might be coming across as frustrated as the discussion is so petty. I don't think it's aggressive.

[GoldWineMemories]

Am I? What do you mean by 'lose'? If you're saying it smells of nothing then, no, you're wrong. If you mean 'lessens', then - obviously. It still retains a smell while also becoming more inherently 'leather-like', to my mind. New leather smell is not what I'd consider the archetypal smell of leather, but then obviously other people will have their own ideas of what that is. I might be coming across as frustrated as the discussion is so petty. I don't think it's aggressive.

I just went and smelled my jacket again. No smell. Now I know you believe nonetheless there is a smell, but I detect none. To go forward in this conversation that there is in fact a smell you'd be asking me to place my faith in you, that you're correct, and that my empirical tools gifted to me are faulty, and that even though I detect no smell there is in fact a smell. I can't do that. So now you understand why people are disagreeing with you, and perhaps you'll lose that frustration with this understanding.

[slpfrsly]

There is no 'forward' to the conversation, as I said this topic ran its course several posts ago. You think leather doesn't smell of anything, as do other people, while simultaneously believing that leather only smells of whatever is used in the treatment process. Ok, fine. I completely disagree on both points. Claiming you're right and I'm wrong on a matter of opinion - your own inability to detect any aroma from your leather jacket taken in to consideration - is a swift spiral in to derailing threads with pettiness. It serves literally no one; not the OP's request, not other people looking to comment, nor anyone who happens to stumble across this thread in the future.

[PrinceRF]

I personally do not think that Tuscan Leather smells feminine; to me, it smells more masculine if anything. But we all have our own interpretation of scents.

Anyways... Ombre Leather or Tuscan Leather?

[GoldWineMemories]

There is no 'forward' to the conversation, as I said this topic ran its course several posts ago. You think leather doesn't smell of anything, as do other people, while simultaneously believing that leather only smells of whatever is used in the treatment process. Ok, fine. I completely disagree on both points. Claiming you're right and I'm wrong on a matter of opinion - your own inability to detect any aroma from your leather jacket taken in to consideration - is a swift spiral in to derailing threads with pettiness. It serves literally no one; not the OP's request, not other people looking to comment, nor anyone who happens to stumble across this thread in the future.

Well now you're just making up stuff I've never said that leather only smells of what's used in the treatment process.

I personally do not think that Tuscan Leather smells feminine; to me, it smells more masculine if anything. But we all have our own interpretation of scents.

Anyways... Ombre Leather or Tuscan Leather?

I agree I don't particularly see Tuscan Leather as femme, but I do think woman can wear it and pull it off. I'm still with Tuscan Leather Ombre is nice, but I wouldn't want to wear either everyday, so if I was wearing one it'd be the one with a little more pizzazz.

[hellbentforleather]

Anyways... Ombre Leather or Tuscan Leather?

I still love TL and it's the first niche-ish frag I ever owned almost ten years ago. I def find it masculine in a "Lemmy from Motorhead" kind of way.

[PStoller]

I've never said that leather only smells of what's used in the treatment process.

Nobody did. Hellbentforleather said, "Much of the 'smell' we attribute to leather are the chemicals used in the tanning process," with which I concurred.

The processing of animal hide into leather is extensive, whether the leather is chrome-tanned or vegetable-tanned. Different tanning imparts a significantly different smell. Of course, it's not merely the chemicals applied to the hides, but the interactions between the chemicals applied to the hides and those that make up the hides themselves. In any case, the effect of the tanning chemicals is such that the finished product smells markedly different from the untreated hide of an animal, living or dead. Untanned hides are rawhide: they certainly smell like something, but not like a jacket, saddle, or upholstery.

So, "leather" is not simply animal hide, but rather a product made from animal hide with tanning chemicals. Over time, the chemical smell fades with off-gassing. As leather is porous, it will also absorb environmental smells, including the smells of our own bodies. We tend to become nose-blind to the smells of our own environment, so it's conceivable that a leather item that smells like nothing to us might smell very much like something to someone else. Neither perception is "wrong," just as it is neither right or wrong to perceive a smell as "masculine" or "feminine"—fragrance qualities that exist solely in the realm of conditioned individual perception.

In summary, leather fragrances mostly mimic the residual scent of tanning chemicals, not the smell of dead cows.

[Hugh V.]

I just tried Ombre Leather again. It's a great scent but a too loud and conspicuous for me to pull off. Once the dry down hits and it becomes more subtle it's frickin' amazing. And with that said, it's still a bit much for me. It's off my to-buy list. But a top notch scent in my opinion. Fahrenheit is more unique but I still prefer OL.